D16Z6, vitaras, 46 trim t3/t04e

confUsed · Post by **confUsed** » Mon May 11, 2009 12:12 am

OK, I see. I'll be ordering some bkr7's for this purpose. Might take a week or so before they arrives, but I'll be back bugging you then

Post by **Bugermass** » Mon May 11, 2009 8:46 am

ok, cool.

confUsed · Post by **confUsed** » Mon Aug 24, 2009 2:15 pm

So its been a while, but I guess I'm in need for help again

I ended up redoing the turbo setup, and I'm running a gt2560r now, which I enjoy very much. It spools so fast, and the topend is actually a lot better than the .48 ar housing allowed me on the t3/t04e. Anyway, I started to run out of time, so I decided to take it to a tuner, just to get it done. Long story short, I got the car back, the numbers was pretty much what I expected.

I took the car on a AutoX event saturday, and to the local circuit yesterday. After the first heat I pulled the plugs (after the car idled for about 5 min). Its not easy to see on the pics, but there's some specs on the porcelain very visible just with a naked eye. So there's something wrong with the tune, I guess...

I accidentally dropped the plugs, so they are in a random order, unfortunately. Before cleaning:

After cleaning (could not get everything off, sorry)

I connected my wideband, and it says 11,6-12.0 during boost. I have only been running low boost (8ish psi). Tuner was talking about the cylinder #1 are running slightly hotter than the rest. It gets 9% more fuel than the rest, and I pulled out 2 degrees in addition once I got back from the dyno, just to be safe. So what does it look like? I'm really not sure where the timing mark on the ground straps are... If someone could mspaint some marks, I would be really thankful, and maybe learn to see this myself :p The heat range looks decent, with ~2 threads colored?... More fuel, or less timing? Also, if anyone has tuned a d16 with a small turbo, it would be really cool to be able to look at the low rpm timing maps. I told the tuner to take a look at the map where the turbo starts to make boost (~2200rpm-3500rpm), because they are just some numbers I punched in hoping they would not be too far out. I guess he missed that part, because the timing in that area is excactly the same as before

I'm attaching the map as well, this is before I pulled the 2 degrees on #1 cylinder. All help are very welcome. I'm broke and would really like to use the car for a bit before the winter arrives

Post by **Bugermass** » Mon Aug 24, 2009 5:29 pm

those plugs are too cold to get an acurate reading at your power level. Try putting some 7s in there and do several hard pulls then take pics of those.

ckretvix · Post by **ckretvix** » Mon Aug 24, 2009 11:39 pm

Just put that turbo on my LS and its response is orgasmic.

Post by **calvin** » Mon Aug 24, 2009 11:51 pm

listen to burgermass!

confUsed · Post by **confUsed** » Tue Aug 25, 2009 10:03 am

Ok, I got a couple sets of new 7's laying here, so I'll do it as soon as I have the time

Post by **Bugermass** » Tue Aug 25, 2009 10:53 am

the reason I say that is cause somthing with too cold a plug the carbon doesn't burn off competely from the plug and you get that pepper look, it can be mistaken for det. With the hotter plugs (correct heat range) you should have complete plug self cleaning and you'll be able to identify det much easier. Also with the correct heat range plug you should get a very distinct timing indicator on the ground strap..

confUsed · Post by **confUsed** » Tue Aug 25, 2009 12:43 pm

Bugermass wrote:the reason I say that is cause somthing with too cold a plug the carbon doesn't burn off competely from the plug and you get that pepper look, it can be mistaken for det.

That is good info! I didnt know that

I'm pretty sure there was some silver (aluminium) stuff in addition to the black, though. I have already ordered a 10x magnifying glass (dont know if that is the correct word for it, lol), but it'll be 2-3 days before it arrives. I'll bring the civic, some bkr7e's and the camera to work tomorrow and shoot some pics after some pulls, and post them right up

confUsed · Post by **confUsed** » Wed Aug 26, 2009 3:36 pm

So today I put in a set of bkr7's and drove around a bit after work. Did some normal driving and a couple pulls. Drove to the side of the road, and checked the plugs, and there was some aluminium specs on them again... So I noticed when driving around that there was some lean spots (spiking to high 14's) during low boost - low vacuum and low rpm. I also added some fuel to get the afr's to hower around 11,5. They were around 11,8, spiking to 12 before. Put in a new set of plugs, and did 4 pulls as soon as the road let me. Turned off the ignition on top of the last and coasted out on the side of the road. Here's the plugs (the order is from left 4-3-2-1): Before cleaning:

After cleaning:

I think there were som specs on these too, but not as bad as before, almost not visible with my eye (still waiting for magnifying glass). I thought it had more than enough fuel on these pulls, because I had added quite a bit, but after seeing the graph from the log, it seems like it spiked to 12.0, but was around 11.4-11.5 for most of the time. This was at 9 psi, creeping to 10.5. I dont know if I'm doing something wrong, or if I'm colorblind or something, but I just cant seem to find any distinct marks on the ground straps... I just mspainted a littel bit where I guess the marks are. Is this looking right, or do I have way too much timing so the marks are at the bottom of the strap?

confUsed · Post by **confUsed** » Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:35 pm

Help?

Pics useless?

David974 · Post by **David974** » Tue Sep 01, 2009 1:20 pm

took off 2 or 3 degree and recheck your plugs to see if the mark move

Post by **Bugermass** » Tue Sep 01, 2009 3:18 pm

^ do that..

Boosted K20 · Post by **Boosted K20** » Tue Sep 01, 2009 3:56 pm

how much timing were you running at those boost levels? Vitara setups require quite a bit more timing. one setup i dyno tuned a few wks ago wanted 23-24* timing at 13 psi (D16Z6). Best to get urself on a dyno and tune it urself if u can find a dyno closer to ur location

confUsed · Post by **confUsed** » Thu Sep 03, 2009 2:54 pm

Unfortunately I ran out of new plugs, lol. Have to wait a couple days before some new ones arrives. However, I scraped off the aliminium specs on the porcelain with a small screwdriver just to see if I could get rid of the detonation. Removed some more timing, and also made the ignition curves smoother where the torque curve climbs most. There's still lots of aluminium on the porcelain after some pulls... I think the ignition maps looks very low now, compared to other maps. However, my setup includes a cast mani, internal gate and a rather small turbo, so lots of back pressure. So if anyone has a cal with a d16 and a small, fast spooling turbo, I would be very thankful if you would share

I think I can hear some ticking that starts right before 6K rpm, but I'm not sure if its just some mechanical noise or actually detonation. I dont know why it would appear there, though. Since its way beyond maximum torque, and the ignition is similar to the spot where maximum torque appeared. I'll post some pics of the plugs once I get the new ones, but I really dont know if pulling any more timing would do much. Car feels slower too

I'll go out and double check distrubutor timing and valve clearance too, but any advice is appreciated. Here's a couple screenshots from my timing maps and a graph. After the pull in the graph, the plug had lots of aluminium on it... I'm thinking of buying a egt gauge to see what the temperatures are like. Good/bad idea?